Simply put, I think it would be better to have each of the Specializations for the Seven Forms of Lightsaber Combat as Universal Specializations, and for the holes in those Careers to be filled by some other concepts. I’m fully aware that this would mean a lot of work, but it’s something that keeps poking at my thoughts and won’t be ignored.
So what we’d need, at bare minimum, is the following:
- One new Consular Spec
- One new Guardian Spec
- One new Mystic Spec
- One new Seeker Spec
- One new Sentinel Spec
- Two new Warrior Specs
If you guys have any ideas, feel free to drop them here. I do, however, have one guideline: Please try to not make any Mystic or Warrior Specs that have Dark Side Talents. They both already have two.
Just now, I got an idea for a Seeker Spec: the Nomad. The point behind them is that they’re travelers, but not only that they’re good at surviving in the wilds, but travelling and sneaking (sort of a wilderness version of a half-Racer-half-Shadow). A capstone Talent might be “Make Haste,” where once per encounter you can take a second Maneuver for no Strain…or perhaps make that “once per Rank per encounter” and have two of them at different ends of the tree.
Another possibility is a Guardian/Warrior Spec: the Watchdog. Their thing is being able to keep watch for long periods of time and then chase a target at full speed without trouble. Lots of Grit, some Resilience benefits, and a few Shortcuts for Chases.
I’m always interested in making new talent trees (speaking of which, I’ve got one I should get around to sharing), but you face some serious hurdles here.
The biggest is finding specs that fulfill two main criteria: 1, they cannot duplicate an existing in-career spec, or serve as a combination of two, and 2, they cannot be too similar to an existing out-of-career spec.
They’ll have to each find their own niche, and provide their own unique talents.
That is true, I suppose. I’d still at least like to try, you know? On that note, do you have any ideas?
Speaking of, I did have an idea for another Warrior Spec: the Skirmisher. They’d be a mobile Light Ranged combatant with a focus on evading range and sight while pecking at his foes. That said, it sounds somewhat more Seeker in a way…so I wonder if the Nomad should go to Consular or Mystic instead.
Just thinking out loud anyway.
The quickest fix would be to just consider those specs as universal.
Yes, that’s kinda the point…but I’m also trying to fill out the gaps left by making the Form Specs into Universal Specs. I apologize if that wasn’t clear.
I think I understand now. You want specs to replace them in the career.
That will definitely be an endeavor. The issue I can see is what can we/you possibly add to enhance their options, without mirroring another spec too closely, and also not making them overpowered.
Yep, I understand.
I’ve given it some minor thought, but I’ve been busy and haven’t been able to focus on it. It’s the type of project that interests me, so when I get a chance to focus on it, I’ll try and come up with something.
The opening post’s idea is similar to changes to the Jedi career which I’ve been considering for a tabletop game.
The Jedi career (spread between the two CW sourcebooks) has only four specializations, while every other career in the game has six. That leaves two holes in the Jedi career line-up. Furthermore, one of the Jedi specializations - General - seems a bit era-specific (there have been eras which saw Jedi acting as generals - such as pre-Ruusan Reformation and during the CW - and others which didn’t). So there could be an argument for a third hole in the line-up, depending upon the era in which the game is being played.
One solution would be to allow a “home-brew” version of the Jedi career, one personalised for each Jedi character. This could be done either with help from a single FaD career (adding two or three trees from one single FaD career - including the relevant career book - on top of the Jedi’s Padawan/Knight/Master and possibly General base) or by picking two or three trees with a single theme. No more than one tree (or possibly two trees in the case of a Warrior-focused Jedi) would be a lightsabre form tree, preferably from the same career if on a single-career track such as Jedi Consular.
The associated signature ability would be Peerless Interception, or possibly one from the most relevant career sourcebook.
This solution has the advantage that it does not require the invention of new trees and talents - and avoids the accompanying headache of trying to balance correctly the contents of said new trees.
Examples of such “home-brewed”/personalised Jedi careers:
- A Jedi on the Knight-Healer/MedCorps track could have career access to: Padawan, Knight, Master, Niman, Healer, and Sage.
- A Jedi on the more generic Consular track could have career access to: Padawan, Knight, Master, Niman, Arbiter, and Sage (or Advisor instead of Niman).
- Jedi artisans or tech-heads could have: Padawan, Knight, Master, Soresu, Artisan, and Armorer. Or possibly a non-lightsabre form tree instead of Soresu.
- Knight-Pilot (or someone in ExplorCorps*): Padawan, Knight, Master, Starfighter Ace, Navigator, and Artisan (needs to be able to fix the ship!).
- Jedi archivist/EduCorps: Padawan, Knight, Master, Niman, Sage, and Teacher. Or possibly a non-lightsabre form tree instead of Niman.
- Jedi shadow: Padawan, Knight, Master, Shien, Shadow, and Investigator (or Sentry instead of Shien).
- Jedi Warrior track: Padawan, Knight, Master, Shii-Cho, Colossus, and Aggressor. Although this style of “brute” would probably not be common (aside from characters like Pong Krell). Juyo (including the Vaapad talents if that training is available from Windu or others after him) could be substituted for Colossus or Aggressor.
- Jedi member of AgriCorps: Padawan, Knight, Master, Pathfinder, Hermit, Sage.
- Jedi Guardian track: Padawan, Knight, Master, Soresu, Protector, Peacekeeper. Such a character would likely try to pick up the out-of-career Shien tree as well.
*ExplorCorps characters could also be more diplomatically- or wilderness-oriented instead.
On the one hand, I’d really rather just have new Specializations to fill in the gaps. On the other, I almost feel like this idea of yours doesn’t go far enough…
Consider the following, if you may: Players may either choose a singular Career, or choose six non-Universal Specializations from any Career they like; this is called a Career Path. However, the following caveats apply:
- Each player choosing Specs must choose one of three Archetypes: Fighter, Speaker, Thinker. At least three of your Specs
should (EDIT: must) come from Careers of the chosen Archetype.
- Each player must choose whether they are starting play as a Sensitive or not. If they choose to start Sensitive, at least one of their Specs must be from a Force and Destiny Career, and they must start with a Force and Destiny Career-based Spec. If they choose to start play as a non-Sensitive, they must choose a Spec from one of the Edge of the Empire or Age of Rebellion Careers to start.
- If a player chooses to start play as a non-Sensitive, and they include any Specs from the Force and Destiny Careers, they must purchase a Universal Spec that provides a Force Rating of 1, either as the starting benefit (as with Force-Sensitive Exile/Emergent/Outcast or Padawan Survivor) or as one of its Talents (as with Nightsister).
- However, a character does not need to take the six Specializations in any order; they just need to have one they start with based on Sensitivity or lack thereof.
And of course, each of the three Archetypes has six Careers associated with it:
Fighter Careers: Bounty Hunter, Hired Gun; Ace, Soldier; Guardian, Warrior
Speaker Careers: Colonist,
Smuggler Scoundrel; Diplomat, Spy; Consular, Mystic
Thinker Careers: Explorer, Technician; Commander, Engineer; Seeker, Sentinel
Finally, the Seven Form Specs (Shii-Cho Knight, Makashi Duelist, Soresu Defender, Ataru Striker, Shien Expert, Niman Disciple, and Juyo Berserker) are considered their own Career which falls under none of the Archetypes. They aren’t Universal in that buying them outside of your chosen Career Path has no additional XP cost, but Universal Specs don’t need to be part of your chosen Career Path.
I really liked this take. One of my players did a respec and went Padawan/Knight/Shadow/Shien and likes the new build much better.
How would you fit the Clone and Jedi careers and their specs (all in the two CW sourcebooks) into your Fighter/Speaker/Thinker model? (The Clone career has six specs; the Jedi career is the only outlier with only four specs.) Among other things, I’m thinking of if a player wants to start with the Padawan spec from the Jedi career.
(I’m also inclined to rename “Thinker” as “Expert”.)
I’m primarily thinking on the primary Era of the Dark Times and the Rebellion vs Empire Civil War. I think that, if you were to play in an era with the Jedi Order, you could use the Jedi Career as an Archetype in that regard.
As for “Thinker > Expert,” that’s fine, I just called it Thinker because each of the three Archetypes ended with “er.”
How did you handle signature abilities with your Jedi career homebrew? Allow them to take either Jedi or Sentinel? (using Shadow as an example)
That would be my inclination (the choice between three options).
After all, the standard career signature abilites vary wildy in their utility; some can be used almost every session, others really depend upon the narrative making it possible to use them. Some are more “flavour” than “crunch” - which isn’t bad in and of itself, but how enjoyable it is to play depends upon the player(s), GM, and the campaign style in general.
Or there could be two options presented by the GM, drawn from the pool of three (Jedi SA + 2x standard career SA). It depends upon how involved the GM wants to be in the process.
Don’t understand most of what is going on here, but I am following closely. ;)
I figure, the more I read the rules/play the game, the more it will make sense, until one day I will go “ah ha! I understand what they are writing about”, and at THAT point, I can contribute something useful to the conversation.
This is wonderful and I would love to incorporate this into my game.
Nothing’s stopping you! Assuming that you’re the GM or get the GM’s permission, of course.
(Maybe I should start a new thread with a copy of my “personalised Jedi career” post, so as not to distract from Machaeus’ original post.)
I am the GM now, so that works, but if possible I’d like the née thread to help me explain this to my players. I’m newish to this GM role and would like to have something to propose to them.
The new thread/topic has been created.
Wow, this sure fell off my radar! Been a while.
Currently, I have four specialization concepts written down. I’ll post them below:
Spec Name: Nomad
Spec Concept: Sneaky traveler and survivalist
Viable Careers: Consular, Mystic, Seeker
Spec Name: Guerilla
Spec Concept: Light Ranged weapons and evasive tactics
Viable Careers: Guardian, Seeker, Warrior
Spec Name: Watchdog
Spec Concept: Great endurance, watchful, and good at chasing
Viable Careers: Guardian, Sentinel, Warrior
Spec Name: Mentalist
Spec Concept: Focuses on trickery and caution
Viable Careers: Mystic, Sentinel
I’ll probably end up coming back to this and filling it in as I get new ideas. Again, feel free to add your own!